CurtPalme.com Home Theater Forum

ortwin20000 · Joined: 23 Nov 2014 Posts: 33

Hi CRT community,
I got a NEC 9PG Xtra which was used only on desk and after i completed my home cinema i wanted to mount it on the ceiling.
After i set it up which took me 20 hours Smile

the projector shut down with error F9. The STK on the F-Drive was busted because my previous owner had the F-Drive not screwed on the case Sad

I orderd a STK from the internet and after building all together the projector startet with error F8. I wasn't sure so i started the projector again and it gave me the error FC.

I replaced the HOT today and I orderd two more STK for the C-Drive because of the F8 error.

Now i wanted to ask if i can power up the projector without the F-Drive and C-Drive connected?
The STKs are arriving next week but i want to check if the FC error is away.
Can i do that?

I already checked the capacitors and i didn't touched the H.Width. I also checked the other boards and the power supply as good as i could.

Kind regards,
Andreas

**Curt Palme** · Posted: Fri Mar 27, 2015 4:15 pm Post subject:

Yes, you definitely can. Keep in mind that all NEC PG series now are showing many problems due to leaking capacitors. I've had F8 and F9 error messages be due to a bad system and/or deflection board as well, but definitely change the STK chips first, esp, if the board wasn't screwed down..

ortwin20000 · Joined: 23 Nov 2014 Posts: 33

Thanks for your fast feedback.
I powered up the projector and it is working without error code Very Happy

Now i must wait until next week when the other two STKs arrive. I hope the F-Drive and C-Drive is working also.

Kind regards
Andreas

CasetheCorvetteman · Joined: 09 Nov 2008 Posts: 6319 Location: Australia

Why did you swap out the H-Out transistor and what part did you use? Its pretty important you use the exact replacement there.

ortwin20000 · Joined: 23 Nov 2014 Posts: 33

Hi,
i changed the transistor with a sanyo 2SC5047 as someone suggested earlier because the FC error means "+15V down" and could be a defective HOT or something else. Luckely it was the HOT as it seems. The positive side effect is that this transistor is not going to be as hot as the old one. AVSForum

hansilili · Joined: 09 Mar 2007 Posts: 302 Location: Köln, Germany

Hi Andreas,

good to see you here! Hope it helps your PGs reliability.

Cheers
rumpeli, ehh...hansilili

ortwin20000 · Joined: 23 Nov 2014 Posts: 33

Got the two STKs today for the C-Drive.
After setting everything together the projector is running but shuts down with error F8 again.
Without the C-Drive the NEC is running fine and without error.

As i replaced the STKs already, what could be the problem with the C-Drive now?

**Curt Palme** · Posted: Tue Mar 31, 2015 12:31 am Post subject:

Could be more issues on the C output board, or the drive signal from the system board is bad, causing the output board to overload.

**Curt Palme** · Posted: Tue Mar 31, 2015 12:32 am Post subject:

I do have a few C drive boards left that I'd sell for cheap, less than you probably spent on the STK chips, if you want to go that route.

CasetheCorvetteman · Joined: 09 Nov 2008 Posts: 6319 Location: Australia

Did you try clearing all memories?

ortwin20000 · Joined: 23 Nov 2014 Posts: 33

I checked the C-Drive again and found a bad resistor (R8030A 0,33 ohm 2w) near the CP connector. Will replace this one also.

I reset all Focus related entrys and not the keystone Sad

There are no big +/- changes so i didn't touched them.
I deleted only all Signal Entrys and startet with a temporary one.

If this is also not working maybe i try an replacement board from Curt.
Is this model specific?

CasetheCorvetteman · Joined: 09 Nov 2008 Posts: 6319 Location: Australia

Deleting all signal entries should give you everything at midpoint, with all blanking at 100.

Then start with PHASE. You dont do anything without getting that set right first.

ortwin20000 · Joined: 23 Nov 2014 Posts: 33

I got the new resistor today.
Soldered it, placed the boards in the projector. Set all entrys to null and startet with all boards connected.

It's working again Laughing

Thank you all for your help.

Best wishes from my homecinema with working NEC projector Wink

CasetheCorvetteman · Joined: 09 Nov 2008 Posts: 6319 Location: Australia

Well done mate Wink

Make sure you always set that PHASE Smile

ortwin20000 · Joined: 23 Nov 2014 Posts: 33

Hi folks,
back again with my working NEC and another interesting problem.

After setting up the NEC the raster grid is visually in a good condition for a beginner Smile

but the picture have a little bow on the left and right side. Looks like ) and ). Both bows are equall.

Why does the grid looks ok and the picture gets a bow? I asked this question also on the german board beisammen.de and someone has written that it could be a pot on the deflection board but where could be this pot?

At the moment i use my side masking so the bow is not visible but i would like to know if i made a mistake on setup or what the problem could be.

Kind regards,
Andreas

CasetheCorvetteman · Joined: 09 Nov 2008 Posts: 6319 Location: Australia

Adjust the PIN-BALANCE.

ortwin20000 · Joined: 23 Nov 2014 Posts: 33

I already tried this but it was also affecting the raster and this is ok only the video signal has the bow.

Yesterday I started the projector and at the beginning was no bow. After 10 minutes i realized the bow again.
I played with the some settings and it went away with the amplitude. When i set this to narrow the bow is comming again.

CasetheCorvetteman · Joined: 09 Nov 2008 Posts: 6319 Location: Australia

Forget the raster... You align the image, you watch the image. All geometry settings affect the raster.

The amplitude affects the pincushion, it SHOULD NOT affect the bow.

Ill write you up a full procedure when i finish my cigarette.

ortwin20000 · Joined: 23 Nov 2014 Posts: 33

Thank you for your help.

I will make a photo the next time to show you how it looks like. The bow is more in the bottom half of the picture. It is not from top to bottom.

CasetheCorvetteman · Joined: 09 Nov 2008 Posts: 6319 Location: Australia

OK, first thing you do is display your source image, then I want you to set all settings to mid point. including STATIC. Blanking gets set to 100, or fully open. Leave the machine to run with a movie playing for about 30 minutes. Make sure your mechanical focus is perfect.

Next, go to the COPNVERGENCE menu and select PHASE, set that correctly. You should have the hump as close to center as possible, and the horizontal lines should be straight from side to side, no bumps or humps at the ends. Don't worry about the angles or bows, this is normal.

Next, display the cross pattern, turn on green only, which should be dead center of your screen if PHASE is set correctly. Turn the deflection yoke so the lines are as close to where they should be as possible, so you don't have to use as much tilt/skew to correct it.

Go into the ALIGNMENT menu. Adjust TILT/SKEW, and BOW until the cross is perfect.

Got to KEYSTONE, adjust that until it is pretty close.

Now turn off the test pattern, and adjust AMPLITUDE until your image is just filling the screen. You must do this with the sourse image. Doesn't have to be perfect just yet, just close. Use IMAGE SHIFT if the image is not centered horizontally within the raster, and use RASTER SHIFT to move the image and raster around until they are in the center of the tube face which should be the center of your screen. If not, your projector is either not straight to the screen, or the tilt angle is wrong.

Turn on the CROSS COARSE pattern.

Adjust the settings to get the pattern as perfect as you can, start with LINEARITY, then PINCUSHION/KEYSTONE, then PIN BALANCE/KEY BALANCE. The lines in the middle should not move much, if at all.

Revisit TILT/SKEW and BOW with the single cross.

Now go back to your image, set it so it is just touching the edges of your screen, then set PINCUSHION and KEYSTONE as well as PIN BALANCE and KEY BALANCE til they are perfect, by now your green should be very close to spot on.

Now use POINT to make any areas on the green as perfect as you can, although it should be very close without that.

Check to see that your green image will now just slightly overlap the edges of your screen. This very minor adjustment wont affect PIN or KEY settings enough to worry.

Next up, turn on the RED, loosen the lens angle screws, display the CROSS COARSE pattern. Set the LINEARITY and AMPLITUDE as close as you can to the GREEN pattern, angle the tube so that when the image is centered on the RED tube face ( use the RASTER SHIFT for this ), the RED pattern overlaps the GREEN very closely. Look only at the middle ( as in where the single cross would be ) as the corners are not yet important.

Display the CROSS. Open the top cover and the DEF board. Adjust the red deflection yoke so the red cross aligns with the green as good as it will get in both directions. Shut the DEF board and close the top cover. Use TILT/SKEW and BOW to get it perfect.

DO NOT use STATIC to move the cross, this is the job of RASTER SHIFT.

The red cross should be now perfectly overlapping the green cross.

Display the CROSS COARSE pattern. The linearity and amplitude should be very close. Adjust KEYSTONE/PINCUSHION and their two BALANCE settings, revisit LINEARITY and AMPLITUDE settings til the red is as perfectly overlapping the green as is possible.

Use RED POINT to get the last bit of perfection, although it shouldn't take much at all.

Doing BLUE is simular to RED, but you don't need to open the DEF board to adjust the deflection yoke.

Lastly, with the image on screen, check to see if fills the screen perfectly all the way around. If you did as I said, it will.

If you follow that, you will then have 3 perfectly centered images on all 3 tube faces, your geometry will be perfect, and your convergence will be perfect.

NEC projectors have the absolute BEST convergence and geometry of any CRT projector BAR NONE. They have the finest adjustment steps, and they have the most of them by almost 3 times. Despite all the excitement and praise for the "amazing geometry and convergence ability of the Barco 909/Cine 9", NEC smoked the sh** out of it back in 1992, if not before ( I haven't seen a GP5000 or GP3000 to know what they had ). The Barco has 81 points, theyre not fine enough to get absolute pixel perfection from corner to corner, and the rest of the convergence system leaves a fair bit to be desired ( its quick, and quick is crude ). The NECs have over 200 points of very fine adjustment, as well as having absolute full geometry adjustment of each colour ( with every setting having a full 201 steps compared to the Barco having 100 on some items, and much less on others ), which are also considerably finer than the finest Barco setting.

There is no good reason this NEC cant have the absolute best of pixel perfect convergence from corner to corner, as well as dead straight lines on the cross hatch pattern.