CurtPalme.com Home Theater Forum

[innof]

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Hello to All I am running a PS3 set to output 1080P to a Marquee 8500 which has new tubes installed. Once all of the calibration was done, and, I scroll through the internal test patterns generated by the projector I get what appears to be "wave" like distortion on the left hand portion of the all white test screen - from the very edge of the screen running approximately 12 inches in or so. This vertical ondulation that looks like creasing is not evident on the actual picture. When the two types of cross-hatch test patterns are up I can also tell that the squares are not as crisp as the rest in this particular left portion of the screen affected. Anyone here have a clue as to what this can be? And, how can I correct it? Thanx Very Much

[andreas]

I am running the same setup on my 9500 and have similar issues. It sounds like bandings? but i'm not sure banding makes the picture less sharp where it occurs. A good geometry set up can reduce it. There are also some antibanding mod to correct it.

[Nashou66]

Id say its ringing. Are they like vertical bars going about 8-12 inches from the screen edge and easily seen in lighter images?

Youll need a Video Processor to get rid of it.

Athanasios

[innof]

Hello to you both, and, allow me to extend my appreciation for your insights here. Andreas, I have no idea what "banding" is or what it means; Please do forgive my ignorance since I am by no means an expert. What is this due to to? The image generated from a source does not seem to be affected, it is moreover when I scroll through the two different internal cross-hatch patterns that I can distinguish the squares on the far most left portion of the screen are not as distinct as the rest. Now, this begs the question that if I am witnessing this lack of detail on the test pattern is it actually there as well in the image but I'm just not able to see it? Athanasios, likewise, I do not know what ringing is nor what causes it? You are correct in your assessment that the lines are 8 to 12 inches from the left edge and seem to be more opaque in color; I have not really tested as to whether I can see this with lighter passages on film (I will try today). Incidentally, my Playstation 3 is being fed to the Marquee via a HD Fury; It was one of the first generation units of the product. Why do I require a video processor to get rid of it. Interesting thing is that the set-u I outlined here is on sourece 1 of the projector. I have only one other source hooked up on 2 which is a computer and I do not see any of these "phenomenon"...... How come its visible on one source and not the other? Please do let me know what I need to do. Thanx Folks

[Nashou66]

Well 1080p Will introduce ringing. It has to do with the scanning of the lines across the phosphor and the time the electron beam has to "settle down" before it begins the new line. There is not enough"blanking" time for the beam to settle down with regards to the timings the PS3 uses. A video processor allows you the ability to alter those timings to increase the blanking area to give the electron beam enough time to settle down. The timings from your second source do not have the same timings as the PS# or many other 1080p sources so you will not see the vertical faint bars in the image on the left.

Athanasios

[innof]

Hello again Athanasios. Well, as much as I am not pleased to report it, you were indeed correct that these "ripples" which you labelled ringing are actually visible during the film image; Albeit extremely faint and only truly noticeable when the picture passage is light in color. My screen is 96 inches in width and this artifact stretches out approximately 8 inches from the left portion of the screen. So, based on your last reply, this is ultimately a PS3 issue and not something to do with the projector. Are there any mods to address this? And, will purchasing a newer HD Fury serve to ameliorate the condition? Lastly, can you please recommend an affordable and reliable processor - Thanx Very Much! This has proven to be most enlightening

[draganm]

[draganm]

oh, forgot to mention. 720P will be sharper on the 8500 than 1080P, especially a stock machine. With a scaler I would run 1440 x 810 @72Hz refresh rate.

[Nashou66]

Here is a great reading on the basics of a Video Signal.

Building Blocks of a Video Format

Athanasios

[innof]

Hi Draganm. And, thank for the input, I do appreciate it. How much does this "Ringing" anomoly actually impact the picture quality? And, is it harmful for the operation of the projector (in other words, does it compromise the electronics of the system)? I will indeed look up porch sizes and what this entails. Obviously, the video scaler which I will require will need to have a HDMI input. However, one last thing that I do want to mention is this consideration with regards to a Marquee 8500 not being able to fully resolve 1080P - What's the real deal with this? I had opinions from both camps but never anything truly definitive. In my very humble opinion, 1080P on my 8500 looks great; I'm sure that the brand new tubes and a pretty solid set-up have helped he cause. When I've run Blu-Ray test discs to evaluate the resolution, the results are that it is fine.......

[jbmeyer13]

HDM ringing, great topic..LOL Nash and I had a lot of fun with my Lumagen HDQ but once you get the learning curve down it's the best money you can spend to improve your video chain. You can get an HDQ here: http://www.ebay.com/itm/LUMAGEN-HD-VIDEO-PROCESSOR-VIS-HDQ-DVI-SDI-/270940573393?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3f15510ed1

By setting custom resolutions and porch timings you can expand the size of the raster large enough to shift the ringing out of the active image area. If set up properly your active image will occupy the same exact portion of the raster as it does now and you won't see the jailbars running down the left side of the screen.

Banding is a different issue all together. To fix that issue you either need to mod your CLM (see Tim's anti-banding mod) or will need to spend hours perfecting the vertical linearity.

[innof]

Thanks for the link Athanasios, I will certainly read up on the topic. I'm really looking forward to some insights on the issue of 1080P resolution capability from my last thread posted here as well as whether or not "Ringing" can potentially damage the projector...... Also, I do appreciate your contribution jbmeyer13; That link for the Lumagen HDQ does not seem to have a HDMI input - How do i hook my PS3 to that video processor? So, here's that other term "Banding" crop up again- Which of these two do you folks think it is, "Ringing" or "Banding" occuring in my instance? Incidentally what does HDM stand for (jbmeyer13 wrote this before the term "Ringing"). Thanx

[jbmeyer13]

[draganm]

[innof]

Okay jbmeyer13, sounds good. Do I lose any image quality by using a HDMI to DVI adapter or is the signal preserved? I don't see any horizontal lines so I'm probably not suffering from any banding issues draganm - Is it difficult to set up different channels on this set? I'm assuming that what you outlined in not referring to the "Source" function of the projector. Is the "Ringing" issue responsible for the lack of sharp definition on the cross-hatch patterns in the left hand segment of the screen? Thanx!

[Phoenixed]

Innof

I pump my marquee with 1080i signal from my ps3 and it goes through my vision hdq gets upscaled to 1080p. The results are awesome. Dvi and HDMI produce the same quality video, dvi has a bandwidth limitation but I wouldn't worry about it.

[innof]

Hi Phoenixed. Is the reason you're upscaling it via the processor effectively eliminate the "ringing" issue I've encountered? Any input from draganm on channel setups? Thanx!

[Nashou66]

for every resolution you can set up a channel or recall. You have to first unlock that memory, do geometry,convergence etc then re lock it again to save changes for that Channel/Memory. its in the utilities menu for source.

Athanasios

[jbmeyer13]

[dvh99]