CurtPalme.com Home Theater Forum

**ecrabb**

Save the jokes... "Door stop", "boat anchor", and "wheel chocks" are good answers to the "application" question, but not this one... Wink

Seriously, a friend bought a house last year that has a small multi-use room/theater with a 2005-vintage digital - an Optoma EZPro 739 XGA single-chip DLP. It was a $1300 entry-level machine back then. That was back when digital looked like total ass.

Anyway, the bulb died over the weekend, so she asked for advice. Bare bulbs are $120 or so on fleabay, and complete replacement lamps are about $200. I doubt the projector is worth $150 working, so she's not sure it's worth putting any money into it, and definitely not $200+.

I suggested she could look at a new projector like an Epson 8350, but she doesn't want to spend $1200. I told her most of the new stuff under $1000 isn't that great, and she doesn't want to spend even that much money. So, I said she could probably get a pretty decent used 720p projector for under $500 - maybe even with a spare bulb.

I looked a few minutes this afternoon and found a single-chip 720p DLP Planar that looked pretty decent for around that price, but I'm not really seeing a lot else. It seems like it's the 2005 or older vintage stuff, or it's up in the $800-900 ball park. For instance, there's an Optoma HD73 on Videogon for $850. Why in God's name would anybody pay $850 for a three-plus year-old 720p digital when you get a brand new 1080p Epson 8350 with dynamic iris, lens shift, and vertical expansion for $1200? I certainly wouldn't! There aren't as many used digitals on ebay as I'd expect, either.

Anyway, anybody got any suggestions for specific models - say, something lesser known (like the Planar) or under appreciated? I'm just asking because I thought maybe one of you guys would know of a couple models off-hand... I don't really have any interest in combing the forums to see what the hot $2000 projector was four years ago.

Thanks, guys!

SC

HogPilot · Posted: Thu Dec 02, 2010 11:42 pm Post subject:

There's a couple Marantz VP-12S4's for sale on fleabay for reasonable prices. My buddy got a 12S3 for $800 delivered with most of the bulb life left, and it throws a very nice picture. I'd try one of those well before an Optoma - I owned an HD72 and was not really impressed with the lack of installation flexibility, cheap optics, or fan/color wheel noise.

Just my $0.02 worth...

**Curt Palme** · Posted: Thu Dec 02, 2010 11:44 pm Post subject:

If it's the first bulb in the unit, I'd get another one, as that will be the cheapest way to go. The DLPs usually last 2-3 bulb lifes.

I wouldn't buy a used one on eBay, you never know how its been used..

**ecrabb** · Posted: Fri Dec 03, 2010 12:08 am Post subject:

Yeah, but that thing's a POS, Curt. XGA (so barely resolves more than SD DVD), general-use (not for HT), entry-level... I wouldn't spend a dollar on it, personally. It's a perfect example of why I hated digital and got into CRT in the first place. I'd ebay or craigslist it and if I got $100 for it, I'd be thrilled.

Besides, you don't know how anything on ebay has been used. At least with the digital projector, if a guy with good feedback says it only has 450 hours on it, it's in perfect condition, then you can trust that's in good shape just as much as you can anything else. Once you get it, you can check, and if the hour counter matches, and it looks good, it's probably legit and you can probably expect it last as long as if you'd bought it new.

I think I'd be much more apt to buy a working Marantz with 500 hours on it for $500 than I would to put $200 in the Optoma, but then that's just me.

SC

WanMan · Joined: 19 Mar 2006 Posts: 9668

I would check Projector Central (I now hate myself, even more, for making that recommendation) for some 720P based projectors in LCD. Check \/ideogon as well. Honestly, though, I do not think women value electronics the same way guys do. My wife would still be watching 480i in terrible presentation on a 27" 500 year old boob-tube had she not meet my expensive butt.

greg_mitch · Joined: 03 May 2006 Posts: 5198

http://www.amazon.com/Optoma-HD65-Projector-Backpack-Speakers/dp/B003AM8B5G/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1291340488&sr=8-1

720p for $599

Plus she gets a free backpack and portable speakers!

It will kill that old POS and the thing looks pretty good if you don't care for black level.

If she has or you want to help her you can get it by Monday with Amazon Prime.

**Curt Palme** · Posted: Fri Dec 03, 2010 2:16 am Post subject:

Spanky Ham · Joined: 22 Mar 2006 Posts: 3967 Location: Comedy Central

What about a CRT? Smile

There doesn't seem to be a lot of options of videogon. I might consider the Panny 200 for $600. If she wants to wait till the end of the month, then I will make her a good deal on my Marantz VP4001.

WanMan · Joined: 19 Mar 2006 Posts: 9668

HogPilot · Posted: Fri Dec 03, 2010 12:45 pm Post subject:

Here's something worth looking at:

http://cgi.ebay.com/Optoma-HD80-DLP-Home-Theater-Projector-REFURBISHED-/270674091761?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3f056edef1

The HD80 was Optoma's first "budget" 1080p projector ($2700) - biggest downside was its fixed 37% lens offset, which required it to be ceiling mounted pretty high, so this may or may not work in your friend's setup depending on her screen size, throw, and ceiling height. Upsides are it throws a LOT of light, and has a manual iris that can be dialed down to gain some CR and cut brightness. Plus it has a 6x color wheel, so only a very small percentage of people should see rainbows.

For $800 with a new bulb, it's not a bad deal. At least it's a newer unit, and she'll be getting into the 1080p game.

TheVerge · Joined: 19 Jul 2009 Posts: 918

Spanky Ham · Joined: 22 Mar 2006 Posts: 3967 Location: Comedy Central

I wouldn't call them awesome blacks. I am not even sure if I would call any DLP decent blacks. They are adequate. I was watching Fringe on my Marantz last night and kept thinking that the dark scenes (which were many) would look a multiple better on my CRT.

**ecrabb** · Posted: Fri Dec 03, 2010 3:17 pm Post subject:

Verge, it looks like you can get the same (cheaper) Hong Kong bare bulbs like you can for everything else...
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=200476874272

About twice the price of some of the cheaper bulbs, but $278 is better than $800.

I saw a 12s2 that might be a possibility, but the 12s3 - and definitely the 12s4 - seem to go for way more money than she's going to want to spend. But, the 12s2 is like an eight-year-old projector! Anybody want to take a guess at what would have the better picture... The new cheapie Optoma HD65 that Greg posted (which has to be kind of a POS at that price), or the EIGHT year old machine. It seems like it should be the better machine, but that was a LONG time ago. I absolutely HATED the picture - universally - from almost all digitals back in 2002... Hell, that's why I got into CRT!

Obviously the build- and lens-quality would be superior on the Marantz, but something tells me that most - if not all - of the picture quality from the 8-year old machine at $12,995 MSRP has filtered down to the <$1000 machines. I mean, if most of the tech from the $12,995 machine got into the $6500 machines two years later, then into the $3000 machines another two years later, then into the $1500 machines two years later, that's another two years to get into the ~$750 machines.

SC

TheVerge · Joined: 19 Jul 2009 Posts: 918

I've never seen a 12S4, but somebody on avs was claiming they completely destroy the budget 720p's that are out there today. I have seen an HD65.. it will make a CRTer cry Sad

(i'm sure the marantz will as well).

I dunno about a 12S2.

The Optoma HD66 is Darkchip 3(although i haven't seen a review on em, you'd figure it would be a notch above the HD65) and 650.00 Dunno if that is out of her price range, but that is new.

Spanky Ham · Joined: 22 Mar 2006 Posts: 3967 Location: Comedy Central

Cry in a good way or bad way?

I wouldn't buy any pj over three years old.

HogPilot · Posted: Fri Dec 03, 2010 4:06 pm Post subject:

In all honesty, the specs on most of the cheapo 720p machines are overinflated, and would never be achievable in a real-world, watchable setup. I had an Optoma HD72 that claimed a 5,000:1 on/off CR - once it was calibrated, I measured about 900:1. Granted, this was with dynamic black turned off, but I found the image unwatchable with it on as it created a very visible pumping of the black levels. I haven't seen a VP 12S2, but my buddy's VP 12S3 definitely has superior black levels and a much better overall image as compared to my HD72, and it's only rated at 3,800:1 on/off.

If you can find one, a Planar 7130 or 7150 are usually in the $500-$600 range, and the 7150 that I owned for a while actually threw a really nice image and had a decent amount of H/V lens shift and zoom. They're pretty big, but a great value.

Either way, given what your friend is using right now, just about anything will be a step up in image quality.

**ecrabb** · Posted: Fri Dec 03, 2010 4:50 pm Post subject:

Excellent comments and discussion, boys... So, HogPilot... Out of everything we've been talking about here, would you probably lean toward the that Planar 7130 - especially if you could get it for say, $450 plus shipping?

And I totally agree that any of these machines will be a huge step up in image quality from what she has, which is total crap.

Thanks,
SC

HogPilot · Posted: Fri Dec 03, 2010 7:13 pm Post subject: